Discussion Forum > 4T
Michael B.:
<< 1. Write a list of 4 tasks. 2. Do two. 3. Add two. >>
Do you find that more effective than the method I give in "Secrets of Productive People"? This is:
1. Write a list of 5 tasks. 2. Do three. 3. Add three.
I personally found that the 5-3 format had more drawing power than the 4-2 format. I also found 5-3 to be superior to 2-1 and 5-2. But obviously this can be quite an individual thing.
I'm not clear from your description what you do with uncompleted tasks. Do you re-enter them immediately as in the 5-3 system?
<< 1. Write a list of 4 tasks. 2. Do two. 3. Add two. >>
Do you find that more effective than the method I give in "Secrets of Productive People"? This is:
1. Write a list of 5 tasks. 2. Do three. 3. Add three.
I personally found that the 5-3 format had more drawing power than the 4-2 format. I also found 5-3 to be superior to 2-1 and 5-2. But obviously this can be quite an individual thing.
I'm not clear from your description what you do with uncompleted tasks. Do you re-enter them immediately as in the 5-3 system?
January 28, 2016 at 11:18 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
"Do you find that more effective than the method I give in "Secrets of Productive People"? This is: 1. Write a list of 5 tasks. 2. Do three. 3. Add three."
I think so, but it may come down to 4T fitting me better.
For me, it started with SMEMA. It was easy for me to remember and had a fast pace: "do two, add two", but had some drawbacks.
I bought your new book in the fall, and immediately began using your five task method. I also used the 5T variation you posted in the forum in preparation for your possible journal-based productivity system (write five tasks, do four in any order, no new tasks or re-entries until the four are done, then add four more).
Both 5T methods are first class, though I usually prefer the flexibility of doing the tasks in any order, as in your 5T variation. The drawback for me with that variation is the doing of four tasks in a row before adding four new ones. It seems to be too many tasks in a row for me before adding new ones.
Your 5T systems seemed to relax me and yet spur me into action, giving me a sense of relief, progress, and engagement (drawing power) that I don't get when using most list based methods (because they eventually overwhelm me, even though I prefer the comprehensiveness of an ongoing list).
In using 5T and your 5T variation, I found that after completing two tasks I would want to write more tasks down. My mind seemed to want that pace. My whole body relaxed when I started going with the rhythm "do two, add two". Seeing two tasks remaining was also an easy reminder to add exactly that amount of tasks. As simple a concept as 5T is ("do three, add three when down to two"), it would somehow confuse me at times that two remaining tasks are the cue to add three new tasks. So I kept defaulting to "do two, add two" and this worked best with four initial tasks. The combination of four tasks with the "do two, add two" rhythm seems to have a number of benefits, including:
• Faster movement through the list.
• Easy to remember: when you're down to two, add two.
• It seems to pull me in and keep me engaged (drawing power).
It would probably work well with people who are slightly impulsive, easily distracted but also hyper-focused when engaged, impatient, and like flexibility in sequencing.
When I started using 4T I imagined you probably already tested it and every variation there is between three and five tasks! So it's nothing new, but I felt that after my experience with it this week (low motivation, sense of overwhelm using FVP, then switched to 4T and got active) that it would be good to expose it to a wider audience in case any one finds it equally effective.
"I personally found that the 5-3 format had more drawing power than the 4-2 format. I also found 5-3 to be superior to 2-1 and 5-2. But obviously this can be quite an individual thing."
Yeah, it's probably just an individual thing.
"I'm not clear from your description what you do with uncompleted tasks. Do you re-enter them immediately as in the 5-3 system?"
No. I've been doing as in your 5T variation. I add two new tasks, including re-entries, only after doing two tasks.
Maybe I should try re-entering them immediately.
One thing I've not mentioned on the forum before is that a big part of why I post ideas is because I know you may spot some potential no one else has, and will then create something better and more refined. A few examples:
I posted the results of a test I did with your systems a few years ago, in which I found that the most effective results were coming from a combination of FV and AF2 (after completing a task in the chain, scanning backwards to the start of the list from the *next* task in the chain and dotting tasks along the way). The problem was the scanning backwards was taking too long from the next task up the chain. A few years later you found the elegant and simple solution: scan backwards from the *completed* task after briefly looking at the next task up the chain (FVP).
My "Binary SMEMA" post. I wanted that to inspire you to create a "no list" FVP for us after seeing me take a crack at it. Soon after, you did!
And finally, that strangely controversial huge list of possible questions for FVP I posted a few months back. I posted that mostly in the hope that you or someone else would spot a wording in there that hadn't been thought of, and that it might result in a better wording I hadn't thought of!
I think so, but it may come down to 4T fitting me better.
For me, it started with SMEMA. It was easy for me to remember and had a fast pace: "do two, add two", but had some drawbacks.
I bought your new book in the fall, and immediately began using your five task method. I also used the 5T variation you posted in the forum in preparation for your possible journal-based productivity system (write five tasks, do four in any order, no new tasks or re-entries until the four are done, then add four more).
Both 5T methods are first class, though I usually prefer the flexibility of doing the tasks in any order, as in your 5T variation. The drawback for me with that variation is the doing of four tasks in a row before adding four new ones. It seems to be too many tasks in a row for me before adding new ones.
Your 5T systems seemed to relax me and yet spur me into action, giving me a sense of relief, progress, and engagement (drawing power) that I don't get when using most list based methods (because they eventually overwhelm me, even though I prefer the comprehensiveness of an ongoing list).
In using 5T and your 5T variation, I found that after completing two tasks I would want to write more tasks down. My mind seemed to want that pace. My whole body relaxed when I started going with the rhythm "do two, add two". Seeing two tasks remaining was also an easy reminder to add exactly that amount of tasks. As simple a concept as 5T is ("do three, add three when down to two"), it would somehow confuse me at times that two remaining tasks are the cue to add three new tasks. So I kept defaulting to "do two, add two" and this worked best with four initial tasks. The combination of four tasks with the "do two, add two" rhythm seems to have a number of benefits, including:
• Faster movement through the list.
• Easy to remember: when you're down to two, add two.
• It seems to pull me in and keep me engaged (drawing power).
It would probably work well with people who are slightly impulsive, easily distracted but also hyper-focused when engaged, impatient, and like flexibility in sequencing.
When I started using 4T I imagined you probably already tested it and every variation there is between three and five tasks! So it's nothing new, but I felt that after my experience with it this week (low motivation, sense of overwhelm using FVP, then switched to 4T and got active) that it would be good to expose it to a wider audience in case any one finds it equally effective.
"I personally found that the 5-3 format had more drawing power than the 4-2 format. I also found 5-3 to be superior to 2-1 and 5-2. But obviously this can be quite an individual thing."
Yeah, it's probably just an individual thing.
"I'm not clear from your description what you do with uncompleted tasks. Do you re-enter them immediately as in the 5-3 system?"
No. I've been doing as in your 5T variation. I add two new tasks, including re-entries, only after doing two tasks.
Maybe I should try re-entering them immediately.
One thing I've not mentioned on the forum before is that a big part of why I post ideas is because I know you may spot some potential no one else has, and will then create something better and more refined. A few examples:
I posted the results of a test I did with your systems a few years ago, in which I found that the most effective results were coming from a combination of FV and AF2 (after completing a task in the chain, scanning backwards to the start of the list from the *next* task in the chain and dotting tasks along the way). The problem was the scanning backwards was taking too long from the next task up the chain. A few years later you found the elegant and simple solution: scan backwards from the *completed* task after briefly looking at the next task up the chain (FVP).
My "Binary SMEMA" post. I wanted that to inspire you to create a "no list" FVP for us after seeing me take a crack at it. Soon after, you did!
And finally, that strangely controversial huge list of possible questions for FVP I posted a few months back. I posted that mostly in the hope that you or someone else would spot a wording in there that hadn't been thought of, and that it might result in a better wording I hadn't thought of!
January 28, 2016 at 15:43 |
Michael B.
Michael B.
Michael:
Thanks for the elucidation. I'm sure it is an individual thing, and I even find that changing rhythm can help one when you're feeling a bit stuck.
Yes, you and the other forum contributors are always a fund of good ideas, questions and sometimes disagreements to build on!
Thanks for the elucidation. I'm sure it is an individual thing, and I even find that changing rhythm can help one when you're feeling a bit stuck.
Yes, you and the other forum contributors are always a fund of good ideas, questions and sometimes disagreements to build on!
January 28, 2016 at 17:22 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
I've been using a variant of 5T, but often do not want to reenter an unfinished ("little-and-often") task immediately, as prescribed in Mark's book. So I give myself the flexibility to add any number of other (usually short) tasks to the 5T list before the reentry, and then run 7T or 8T for part of the day.
January 29, 2016 at 17:02 |
ubi
ubi
Update on the paper I'm using in case anyone is curious. It's pocketable, solidly made, inexpensive, easy to find, super-flexible, light, and most importantly uses high-end, snag-free spirals:
Top Flight Poly Cover Memo Book, Black, 100 Sheets, College Rule, 3.5 x 5 in/7.6 x 12.7 cm
Picture: http://bit.ly/1pxECUd
Top Flight Poly Cover Memo Book, Black, 100 Sheets, College Rule, 3.5 x 5 in/7.6 x 12.7 cm
Picture: http://bit.ly/1pxECUd
March 18, 2016 at 4:50 |
Michael B.
Michael B.
Those notebooks are far overpriced on Amazon. I bought mine in a grocery store stationary section for $1.65.
March 18, 2016 at 7:14 |
Michael B.
Michael B.
Thanks for sharing your system Michael B.
I think 4T will be better for me as I feel more comfortable looking at an even number of tasks (4) than odd (5)
I think 4T will be better for me as I feel more comfortable looking at an even number of tasks (4) than odd (5)
March 18, 2016 at 18:34 |
Chino
Chino
I've been finding myself not really caring exactly how many items are on the list. Sometimes 3, sometimes 5, sometimes 6. I think I had 7 or 8 once.
And I also find myself not really caring exactly when and how I add new items to the list. And not really caring what order I work them in.
The main thing seems to be to erase it frequently and deliberately, and start fresh frequently.
And I also find myself not really caring exactly when and how I add new items to the list. And not really caring what order I work them in.
The main thing seems to be to erase it frequently and deliberately, and start fresh frequently.
March 18, 2016 at 21:14 |
Seraphim
Seraphim
Seraphim
Your method will be perfect for work when tasks pop up unpredictably
Your method will be perfect for work when tasks pop up unpredictably
March 19, 2016 at 4:56 |
Chino
Chino
Michael B.:
"It would probably work well with people who are slightly impulsive, easily distracted but also hyper-focused when engaged, impatient, and like flexibility in sequencing."
That, in a nutshell, is a perfect description of ADHD.
See new thread if interested.
(It runs very strongly in my extended, _especially_among_the_high-achievers_. To be honest, as far as I know, only my own kids have been formally diagnosed, but after learning about what ADHD really is, it's pretty obvious. It makes for very interesting family stories, and even more interesting reunion watching. It shows up differently in each person. Each person, and those around them, adapt differently.)
"It would probably work well with people who are slightly impulsive, easily distracted but also hyper-focused when engaged, impatient, and like flexibility in sequencing."
That, in a nutshell, is a perfect description of ADHD.
See new thread if interested.
(It runs very strongly in my extended, _especially_among_the_high-achievers_. To be honest, as far as I know, only my own kids have been formally diagnosed, but after learning about what ADHD really is, it's pretty obvious. It makes for very interesting family stories, and even more interesting reunion watching. It shows up differently in each person. Each person, and those around them, adapt differently.)
March 19, 2016 at 14:08 |
Cricket
Cricket
Cricket:
"That, in a nutshell, is a perfect description of ADHD."
ADD is a fit for that description as well.
"That, in a nutshell, is a perfect description of ADHD."
ADD is a fit for that description as well.
March 19, 2016 at 21:42 |
Michael B.
Michael B.
I've decided Post-it notes are better than a notebook and have returned to using them. I'm currently using these:
Post-it "Super Sticky Full Adhesive" Notes, "Electric Yellow"
http://www.amazon.com/Post-Sticky-Adhesive-3-Inches-Assorted/dp/B005GZ2174
Post-it "Super Sticky Full Adhesive" Notes, "Electric Yellow"
http://www.amazon.com/Post-Sticky-Adhesive-3-Inches-Assorted/dp/B005GZ2174
May 9, 2016 at 1:34 |
Michael B.
Michael B.
I'm now using standard Canary Yellow Post-it notes. They are less expensive than the full adhesive ones and are lighter and thinner for pocketing. Be sure to buy official Post-it notes as the stickiness is superior to the off-brand ones.
May 21, 2016 at 18:38 |
Michael B.
Michael B.
Tip: To prevent your sticky notes from curling after pulling them from a stack, pull them off from side to side as opposed to bottom to top.
May 21, 2016 at 18:42 |
Michael B.
Michael B.
Trying 4T "2+2" today, using Clear.app (Mac & iPhone with iCloud sync). Thanks for the idea. I think I will like the symmetry of it.
May 23, 2016 at 17:08 |
ubi
ubi
ubi:
Let us know how you get on. Using the Clear app should result in a really clean and nimble digital 4T.
Let us know how you get on. Using the Clear app should result in a really clean and nimble digital 4T.
May 23, 2016 at 18:42 |
Michael B.
Michael B.
1. Write a list of 4 tasks.
2. Do two.
3. Add two.
I use it in the following way:
1. I carry a stack of blue post-it notes around in my wallet.
2. I keep this little stack around 5 credit cards thick.
3. I split this stack in half and put the two sticky sides together, making a thin stack with two writing surfaces.
4. In the top right corner of one side, I put a little dot. I write my four tasks on this side.
5. The other side is left blank. This is for reminders, distractions, and notes to be parked during the course of the day. The small size keeps things important and succinct.
6. When I'm ready for a new task page I peel off the completed one, dot the new blank page, and stick the crossed out one into an empty credit card slot in my wallet. At the end of the day I review these to see what I've done.
7. Completing two tasks is my trigger to flip the stack over and check in with the reminders before writing two new tasks.
8. When a reminder page is filled up, one of the two new tasks I write is "--->". Then I transfer any notes to my index card system or journal, events to my calendar, and same-day reminders to the new blank reminder post-it.
9. At the end of the day I transfer any remaining notes from my post-it stack and review my completed pages.