Discussion Forum > Big sequential tasks in long-list systems
I've personally found that I prefer to break it down into whatever feels like a good "unit" that I can complete within a specific amount of time, roughly. I find a single large task isn't as easy to motivate myself on, but something like W&P Ch. X will work well for me. This is, I think, because I have a better chance of completing the task in a single sitting.
June 12, 2022 at 19:43 |
Aaron Hsu
Aaron Hsu
Reading a book is a big sequential task. You can conceive it as a project if you wish. This kind of project though only has one action: the next one. I think the most useful is to specify a specific goal for the next step because yes, Do the Whole Thing is a very demotivating description.
In general, I think you can break down some larger project into whatever steps you like, but the important thing to keep up front on that project is what your next step or steps are. And for inserting into a task list, I suggest only putting one task, or else the project itself, and for that have the project notes tell you the next task.
In general, I think you can break down some larger project into whatever steps you like, but the important thing to keep up front on that project is what your next step or steps are. And for inserting into a task list, I suggest only putting one task, or else the project itself, and for that have the project notes tell you the next task.
June 12, 2022 at 22:00 |
Alan Baljeu
Alan Baljeu
I think each person has to find the way that suits them best. So my method wouldn't necessarily suit someone else.
My method is to use the name of the book and re-enter it whenever I've finished a reading session. That's how I read "War and Peace" and many other books as well. I don't specify how long each session should be, either in time or pages. I just read for as long as want to, whether that's one sentence or ten chapters. The important thing is not how much one reads, but to keep it going.
There's an additional stage for technical books, which is to skim through the chapter (or whatever) to get an idea of what it's about before I start reading.
I've always found that setting targets for how much I'm going to read simply doesn't work. There's too great a tendency to avoid starting because I don't want to read such a long passage. And inevitably that leads to the whole book, magazine or article being abandoned.
So what i'm saying is that success depends more on how often you read rather than how much you read.
And this applies to all systems, not just Superfocus.
My method is to use the name of the book and re-enter it whenever I've finished a reading session. That's how I read "War and Peace" and many other books as well. I don't specify how long each session should be, either in time or pages. I just read for as long as want to, whether that's one sentence or ten chapters. The important thing is not how much one reads, but to keep it going.
There's an additional stage for technical books, which is to skim through the chapter (or whatever) to get an idea of what it's about before I start reading.
I've always found that setting targets for how much I'm going to read simply doesn't work. There's too great a tendency to avoid starting because I don't want to read such a long passage. And inevitably that leads to the whole book, magazine or article being abandoned.
So what i'm saying is that success depends more on how often you read rather than how much you read.
And this applies to all systems, not just Superfocus.
June 12, 2022 at 23:00 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
To me Mark’s discussion keys on the difference between tasks where the pace matters and where it doesn’t so much. Specifically I mean reading a novel has no performance goals (unless it’s for a book club meeting), whereas some other project I do care how much progress I make in a week. So in fact I would normally not set a specific goal for reading from a novel, but I would for a work project.
There’s also a difference of course in that I’ve not adopted the frequent task switching that Mark enjoys, so Mark might read 2 pages at a time and get 20 done in a day, but I would probably read 10 at a time and get 20 done. And in neither case was 20 a specific goal.
For work, I’ll set a specific goal because it helps me focus. Without that focuser I could be all over with work and never get a specific thing done that I can celebrate as complete. But that’s a big non-sequential task.
There’s also a difference of course in that I’ve not adopted the frequent task switching that Mark enjoys, so Mark might read 2 pages at a time and get 20 done in a day, but I would probably read 10 at a time and get 20 done. And in neither case was 20 a specific goal.
For work, I’ll set a specific goal because it helps me focus. Without that focuser I could be all over with work and never get a specific thing done that I can celebrate as complete. But that’s a big non-sequential task.
June 13, 2022 at 2:11 |
Alan Baljeu
Alan Baljeu
Alan Baljeu:
<< Mark might read 2 pages at a time and get 20 done in a day, but I would probably read 10 at a time and get 20 done >>
In fact I'd be much more likely to read something like 10, 4, 5, 17, 2 getting 38 done one day, 2, 5 getting 7 done the next, and 9, 2, 10 getting 21 done the third day. The celebration comes from advancing fast through one of the world's greatest novels.
<< Mark might read 2 pages at a time and get 20 done in a day, but I would probably read 10 at a time and get 20 done >>
In fact I'd be much more likely to read something like 10, 4, 5, 17, 2 getting 38 done one day, 2, 5 getting 7 done the next, and 9, 2, 10 getting 21 done the third day. The celebration comes from advancing fast through one of the world's greatest novels.
June 13, 2022 at 9:05 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
Thanks for the insights, everyone.
Mark writes:
<< My method is to use the name of the book and re-enter it whenever I've finished a reading session.... I don't specify how long each session should be, either in time or pages. >>
That's how I have done it in the past as well. And here I thought this was a bad habit I needed to break. I guess not, then! It seems that your attitude (allowing yourself to read any amount, so long as you do it often) is key in your approach.
And I suppose this thread shows that a variety of approaches are possible. Probably, trial and error is called for.
Mark writes:
<< My method is to use the name of the book and re-enter it whenever I've finished a reading session.... I don't specify how long each session should be, either in time or pages. >>
That's how I have done it in the past as well. And here I thought this was a bad habit I needed to break. I guess not, then! It seems that your attitude (allowing yourself to read any amount, so long as you do it often) is key in your approach.
And I suppose this thread shows that a variety of approaches are possible. Probably, trial and error is called for.
June 13, 2022 at 14:00 |
Belacqua
Belacqua
I try to read all books I start within 30 days, keeping a spreadsheet that records how many pages a day I should read to meet this goal. I then just add the book title to my list, and refer to the spreadsheet for today's goal.
June 13, 2022 at 20:39 |
vegheadjones
vegheadjones
"Read at whim! Read at whim!" -- Randall Jarrell
That said, for stuff I *have* to read -- usually nonfiction or instructional material -- I skim, highlight, go back and reread as needed. At this point in my life, I trust my mind to know what it's looking for to meet this moment's needs. There may be a bit of time wastage since I'm not being 'efficient,' but I'd rather lose a bit of time than expend mental energy on material that doesn't really require that amount of attention.
That said, for stuff I *have* to read -- usually nonfiction or instructional material -- I skim, highlight, go back and reread as needed. At this point in my life, I trust my mind to know what it's looking for to meet this moment's needs. There may be a bit of time wastage since I'm not being 'efficient,' but I'd rather lose a bit of time than expend mental energy on material that doesn't really require that amount of attention.
June 15, 2022 at 14:33 |
Mike Brown
Mike Brown
Lately I have been throwing all my reading into Dendro and then going there when I am too tired to stay focused on my work.
http://dendro.cloud/
It does a good job of presenting me with things repeatedly till I am done with them, intermixed with new things. It also does great at breaking things down into smaller notes that need some revisiting and maybe even memorizing.
http://dendro.cloud/
It does a good job of presenting me with things repeatedly till I am done with them, intermixed with new things. It also does great at breaking things down into smaller notes that need some revisiting and maybe even memorizing.
July 16, 2022 at 2:00 |
Seraphim
Seraphim
Drawing a bit from Stephen Guise’s Miki Habits book, you can enter the task as “W and P 1 page”. It may remind you that you only need to read a little bit at a time. It appears as a very achievable goal which might be motivating. There’s less of a risk of unconsciously building up an expectation that each session needs to be so and so long. Of course, after you read 1 page, you are free to read more if you feel like it. Just a suggestion. You can try it and see :)
July 18, 2022 at 1:23 |
Charles
Charles
Related question: how do y'all treat big tasks like "declutter home" that could be sequential or not.
One decluttering blogger says she always starts with the most visible space first when decluttering, every single time. Then she progressively moves to other spaces less visible, so that the storage room rarely gets touched. This is sequential.
It could also be treated concurrently where you list "declutter garage", and another entry of "declutter closet", and "declutter storage room".
Which do you prefer?
One decluttering blogger says she always starts with the most visible space first when decluttering, every single time. Then she progressively moves to other spaces less visible, so that the storage room rarely gets touched. This is sequential.
It could also be treated concurrently where you list "declutter garage", and another entry of "declutter closet", and "declutter storage room".
Which do you prefer?
July 21, 2022 at 16:03 |
Cameron
Cameron
Cameron:
Let me answer with an old internet meme: "porque no los dos?"
You can have a task that represents the main sequence of the decluttering effort and make additional entries if something sticks out.
The main reason for additional entries would be to clear your head of them. That's the point of a "catch-all" type of list system.
You can also always delete anything later without having worked on it.
Let me answer with an old internet meme: "porque no los dos?"
You can have a task that represents the main sequence of the decluttering effort and make additional entries if something sticks out.
The main reason for additional entries would be to clear your head of them. That's the point of a "catch-all" type of list system.
You can also always delete anything later without having worked on it.
July 21, 2022 at 17:20 |
Christopher
Christopher
Christopher:
<< You can have a task that represents the main sequence of the decluttering effort and make additional entries if something sticks out. >>
That is indeed the way I always do projects of any kind. I have a main task, with sub-tasks, which in turn have sub-sub-tasks to whatever depth of task is necessary. The higher-level tasks are mainly used for generating sub-tasks, but there is nothing to stop you taking some direct action on them if you wish.
Doing it this way is both systematic and flexible.
<< You can have a task that represents the main sequence of the decluttering effort and make additional entries if something sticks out. >>
That is indeed the way I always do projects of any kind. I have a main task, with sub-tasks, which in turn have sub-sub-tasks to whatever depth of task is necessary. The higher-level tasks are mainly used for generating sub-tasks, but there is nothing to stop you taking some direct action on them if you wish.
Doing it this way is both systematic and flexible.
July 21, 2022 at 20:46 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
This got me thinking about previous times I have done this kind of task while using long-list systems. I’ve never been sure about the best way to enter such a task.
For instance, let’s say you want to read “War and Peace” quickly. You could keep re-entering the task as “War and Peace” in Column 2 of Superfocus, like Mark did many years ago: http://markforster.squarespace.com/blog/2011/2/18/end-of-testing-superfocus-v-3.html
But let’s say you want to use Simple Scanning or FVP. Do you:
1. Enter the task as “W and P”
2. “W and P chapter 1” (followed by “W and P chapter 2” after you’re done that)
3. Enter a bunch of chapters at once to remind yourself you have a lot to read
4. Write “W and P” followed by the current page number
5. “W and P pages 235-285” (to set a goal)
6. etc.
?
This might seem like splitting hairs but it could have a noticeable effect (?). I mean, it might affect “standing out,” (the illusion of) resistance, the perceived difficulty of tasks, or even the speed of progress. I don’t know... Even if there is no hard and fast rule, I wonder if there is a general best practice here.
I call reading “War and Peace” a “big sequential task.” By this, I mean that the same or a similar action (reading one segment after another) is repeated in sequence. There are other tasks like that. I contrast this with a big project that has wildly different sub-tasks--like “Giant Research Project X.” The latter, of course, you can break down into smaller tasks in long list and go from there. (Maybe this distinction doesn’t entirely hold, but I offer it for what it’s worth.)
Any thoughts—Mark and others? Any guidance here might be helpful for doing this kind of task in other systems/approaches as well. Though I suppose different list systems may call for different modes of task entry.