Discussion Forum > Task Diary and spreading out tasks over the week?
Hi, David
Well, first of all I'm not writing Holy Writ here, so if you find something that works fine for you then use it - whatever I say!
Having said that, I don't really see what the point is of carrying tasks further forward than tomorrow. Suppose you'd decided that you weren't going to schedule any tasks to Day 2 because you knew that you'd have very little time. So where are you going to put them? On Day 3? Well, that's where they've ended up anyway.
Or perhaps you schedule half those tasks to Day 3 and the other half to Day 4.So that's 12 tasks on each day. But on Day 3 another 10 tasks come in, so you've still ended up with 22 tasks on Day 4. And it may well be more if Day 3 has a lot of interruptions.
What's happening now is that you keep having to put tasks further and further forward in order to keep up. You have lost the essential connection between one day's incoming work and one day's outgoing work. And all you are doing is putting off the day when you finally decide to confront the amount of work you've got and do something about the number of interruptions you're getting.
Well, first of all I'm not writing Holy Writ here, so if you find something that works fine for you then use it - whatever I say!
Having said that, I don't really see what the point is of carrying tasks further forward than tomorrow. Suppose you'd decided that you weren't going to schedule any tasks to Day 2 because you knew that you'd have very little time. So where are you going to put them? On Day 3? Well, that's where they've ended up anyway.
Or perhaps you schedule half those tasks to Day 3 and the other half to Day 4.So that's 12 tasks on each day. But on Day 3 another 10 tasks come in, so you've still ended up with 22 tasks on Day 4. And it may well be more if Day 3 has a lot of interruptions.
What's happening now is that you keep having to put tasks further and further forward in order to keep up. You have lost the essential connection between one day's incoming work and one day's outgoing work. And all you are doing is putting off the day when you finally decide to confront the amount of work you've got and do something about the number of interruptions you're getting.
March 9, 2008 at 23:38 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
I can relate to David's point (although the circumstances may of course be different, because we have different types of work).
In my work as a translator, jobs generally come in an irregular volume, not in neat "day-sized" chunks. Sometimes I manage to clear my "jobs pending" so that I can see the end of "jobs" pending" some time today or tomorrow, but sometimes several days' worth of jobs (or sometimes a couple of weeks' worth) come in all in a rush, so I have to arrange them in a scheduled will-do pattern that can go several days or even a couple of weeks into the future. It is not a complete "will-do" schedule, because I can (hopefully) leave space in the pattern for smaller jobs with shorter deadlines that arrive and need to be slotted in between. But I definitely need a type of "will-do" structure that goes further into the future than tomorrow.
In my work as a translator, jobs generally come in an irregular volume, not in neat "day-sized" chunks. Sometimes I manage to clear my "jobs pending" so that I can see the end of "jobs" pending" some time today or tomorrow, but sometimes several days' worth of jobs (or sometimes a couple of weeks' worth) come in all in a rush, so I have to arrange them in a scheduled will-do pattern that can go several days or even a couple of weeks into the future. It is not a complete "will-do" schedule, because I can (hopefully) leave space in the pattern for smaller jobs with shorter deadlines that arrive and need to be slotted in between. But I definitely need a type of "will-do" structure that goes further into the future than tomorrow.
March 10, 2008 at 8:33 |
Victor
Victor
If you get your work in batches, the problem with not scheduling work further than tomorrow is that you lose the incentive of completing a will-do list for the next day(s).
However, Mark has a point that there is great danger in scheduling too much work forward and ignore the fact that you are going to get other tasks for those days too.
However, Mark has a point that there is great danger in scheduling too much work forward and ignore the fact that you are going to get other tasks for those days too.
March 10, 2008 at 9:40 |
Nick
Nick
Victor:
It's important to distinguish between tasks and projects here. What I was responding to in David's post was the scheduling of *tasks* arising from active projects.
What you are talking about is scheduling when *projects* become active. As a general rule I advise starting projects which have deadlines as early in the time available as possible, rather than leaving them till the last moment. However if you have a lot of translation projects come in at one time, then it certainly makes sense to schedule them within the available deadlines - provided that your schedule is not likely to be disrupted by further projects coming in.
P.S. My definition of "project" here is the same as David Allen's. A project is anything which can't be done in one go. If it can be done in one go, it's a task.
It's important to distinguish between tasks and projects here. What I was responding to in David's post was the scheduling of *tasks* arising from active projects.
What you are talking about is scheduling when *projects* become active. As a general rule I advise starting projects which have deadlines as early in the time available as possible, rather than leaving them till the last moment. However if you have a lot of translation projects come in at one time, then it certainly makes sense to schedule them within the available deadlines - provided that your schedule is not likely to be disrupted by further projects coming in.
P.S. My definition of "project" here is the same as David Allen's. A project is anything which can't be done in one go. If it can be done in one go, it's a task.
March 10, 2008 at 9:57 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
Nick:
You have a good point there. But remember that DIT insists that if you fail to complete your Will Do list you must have caught up within 3 or 4 days.
You have a good point there. But remember that DIT insists that if you fail to complete your Will Do list you must have caught up within 3 or 4 days.
March 10, 2008 at 10:02 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
Just to say that I am finding this discussion and the one on DIT v/& GTD extremely interesting and useful.
I can't add anything very helpful at the moment as I too struggle with the points you have all raised!
gill
I can't add anything very helpful at the moment as I too struggle with the points you have all raised!
gill
March 10, 2008 at 10:38 |
gill
gill
I think the distinction between projects and tasks are an important one.
So in the case of Victor, he gets during the day a new list of projects, possibly with deadlines. As Mark advises you should do projects with deadlines as soon as possible, preferable doing the projects with the latest deadlines first. The key point is as soon as possible: If you get 10 new translation jobs, you cannot do them all at the same time, so you should pick some of them according to some strategy and make them active and do them with the DIT methods. When one of them is finished you can pick the next project.
The important thing to know here, how many projects can you handle on an average day. Here the evaluation process can help, i.e. if you fall behind on your daily tasks, you should ask:
- am I working efficiently
- do I attempt to do more projects at the same time then I can handle?
If the later is the case, then you should inactivate some of your projects. Which ones you should pause, depends on your priorities.
Most of the time after you finished the active projects you can restart the paused ones. You've got a problem if you got new projects faster then you can finish the old ones, then you again overcommited yourself.
Also I think you should also do an evaluation process when you are consistently finish your daily tasks early, in that case you should think about activating more projects (if you have any, if not, than you are lucky and should enjoy your free time :) )
What I am somewhat missing from DIT a master project list, where I can list all my projects, and decide which one should I make active or inactive.
So in the case of Victor, he gets during the day a new list of projects, possibly with deadlines. As Mark advises you should do projects with deadlines as soon as possible, preferable doing the projects with the latest deadlines first. The key point is as soon as possible: If you get 10 new translation jobs, you cannot do them all at the same time, so you should pick some of them according to some strategy and make them active and do them with the DIT methods. When one of them is finished you can pick the next project.
The important thing to know here, how many projects can you handle on an average day. Here the evaluation process can help, i.e. if you fall behind on your daily tasks, you should ask:
- am I working efficiently
- do I attempt to do more projects at the same time then I can handle?
If the later is the case, then you should inactivate some of your projects. Which ones you should pause, depends on your priorities.
Most of the time after you finished the active projects you can restart the paused ones. You've got a problem if you got new projects faster then you can finish the old ones, then you again overcommited yourself.
Also I think you should also do an evaluation process when you are consistently finish your daily tasks early, in that case you should think about activating more projects (if you have any, if not, than you are lucky and should enjoy your free time :) )
What I am somewhat missing from DIT a master project list, where I can list all my projects, and decide which one should I make active or inactive.
March 10, 2008 at 11:47 |
ikokai
ikokai
Very well summarised, Ikokai.
There's nothing to stop you adding any lists you like to DIT, but I personally believe that projects are best kept track of in the Task Diary (if they have a deadline), or in a list of future Current Initiatives in the order you intend to do them (if they don't have a deadline and are simply things you "intend to get round to sometime")
There's nothing to stop you adding any lists you like to DIT, but I personally believe that projects are best kept track of in the Task Diary (if they have a deadline), or in a list of future Current Initiatives in the order you intend to do them (if they don't have a deadline and are simply things you "intend to get round to sometime")
March 10, 2008 at 12:30 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
Hi Mark,
I went back and reread your chapter on the task diary in DIT. You do indeed have a section entitled "scheduling" at the end where you state exactly what I was stating -- one can spread out tasks over several days. So now I am confused, because here you are saying one MUST stick with either doing it today because it is urgent,or putting it on tomorrow's list. But again, what if tomorrow is full of meetings? And the next day is not better, but the two days after that are pretty clear. Would it not make more sense then to schedule some of these tasks automatically for those days?
-David
I went back and reread your chapter on the task diary in DIT. You do indeed have a section entitled "scheduling" at the end where you state exactly what I was stating -- one can spread out tasks over several days. So now I am confused, because here you are saying one MUST stick with either doing it today because it is urgent,or putting it on tomorrow's list. But again, what if tomorrow is full of meetings? And the next day is not better, but the two days after that are pretty clear. Would it not make more sense then to schedule some of these tasks automatically for those days?
-David
March 10, 2008 at 13:03 |
David Drake
David Drake
David:
So I have - I'd forgotten that!
However my thinking on this has hardened since I wrote the book. The person I have best experience of is myself, and I know that I am always only too ready to use loopholes to avoid having to admit that I have taken on too much work.
The important thing is not that you keep rigidly to the rule, but that you appreciate WHY I am saying it. Preserving the link between one day's incoming work and one day's outgoing work is the essential way of keeping your work focused.
So I have - I'd forgotten that!
However my thinking on this has hardened since I wrote the book. The person I have best experience of is myself, and I know that I am always only too ready to use loopholes to avoid having to admit that I have taken on too much work.
The important thing is not that you keep rigidly to the rule, but that you appreciate WHY I am saying it. Preserving the link between one day's incoming work and one day's outgoing work is the essential way of keeping your work focused.
March 10, 2008 at 13:12 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
Hi Mark,
Okay -- sounds good. I can see your points and appreciate the "update" on where you stand on this due to your personal experiences. Spreading out tasks further and further can indeed give one a false sense that they are not overwhelmed.
Thanks as always for your advice!
-David
Okay -- sounds good. I can see your points and appreciate the "update" on where you stand on this due to your personal experiences. Spreading out tasks further and further can indeed give one a false sense that they are not overwhelmed.
Thanks as always for your advice!
-David
March 10, 2008 at 13:19 |
David Drake
David Drake
I will also, with monkish precision regarding the Holy Writ, point out that the Will-Do list is a fixed set of tasks and doesn't expand from day to day. One of those tasks is the Task Diary, which *can* grow and shrink from day to day.
I do diverge on some things, for example, I have a monthly routine where I have to write 5 different reports. I've been doing them for so long, that I do sprinkle components over the course of a week, in a specific order, simply because I despise the work and couldn't bear to do it all in one day. Doing a bit every day keeps the project moving forward and allows me to turn my hand to other things when those pieces are complete.
Also, if I write 12 things down for one day, and can't get to them all, and I don't already have a backlog, then I will declare the undone tasks a backlog, write "backlog" in tomorrow's task diary, and start working them off then. If I'm in between Current Initiatives, then I declare the backlog the CI. (I highlight or check off done tasks, so the backlog are any tasks that are not checked off.) Keeps me from having to write the tasks repeatedly.
mike
I do diverge on some things, for example, I have a monthly routine where I have to write 5 different reports. I've been doing them for so long, that I do sprinkle components over the course of a week, in a specific order, simply because I despise the work and couldn't bear to do it all in one day. Doing a bit every day keeps the project moving forward and allows me to turn my hand to other things when those pieces are complete.
Also, if I write 12 things down for one day, and can't get to them all, and I don't already have a backlog, then I will declare the undone tasks a backlog, write "backlog" in tomorrow's task diary, and start working them off then. If I'm in between Current Initiatives, then I declare the backlog the CI. (I highlight or check off done tasks, so the backlog are any tasks that are not checked off.) Keeps me from having to write the tasks repeatedly.
mike
March 11, 2008 at 23:15 |
Mike Brown
Mike Brown
Mike:
If you are using a page-a-day diary for the Task Diary there's no need to rewrite uncompleted tasks down the next day. Just leave the tasks where they are and continue working with more than one page. That also means that it is easy for you to see how many days you are behind. Remember, if you get more than about four days behind, you must carry out the audit procedure and discover why you are behind (and do something about it). That's also usually the best time to declare a backlog (though don't start tackling it until you have actioned the results of the audit).
If you are using a page-a-day diary for the Task Diary there's no need to rewrite uncompleted tasks down the next day. Just leave the tasks where they are and continue working with more than one page. That also means that it is easy for you to see how many days you are behind. Remember, if you get more than about four days behind, you must carry out the audit procedure and discover why you are behind (and do something about it). That's also usually the best time to declare a backlog (though don't start tackling it until you have actioned the results of the audit).
March 12, 2008 at 11:34 |
Mark Forster
Mark Forster
This is one of the best threads that I've read--and reread--on this forum. I am still a DIT newbie--been doing it less than a month. Till now, I have been violating the nonexistent Holy Writ of DIT; I've been using my "Tomorrow" list as a "Later" list.
Each day I have been reviewing the previous day's "Tomorrow" list and cherrypicking which items to do and which items to put on a new "Tomorrow" list. Not good!
Orthodox DIT tells me that what goes on Tomorrow gets done Tomorrow or I need to declare a backlog. I realize that I still have a ways to go before I can pat myself on the back. I still have not mastered the DIT discipline. But from the enormous benefits that I have gleaned thus far, I am utterly convinced that it will be worth the effort.
Each day I have been reviewing the previous day's "Tomorrow" list and cherrypicking which items to do and which items to put on a new "Tomorrow" list. Not good!
Orthodox DIT tells me that what goes on Tomorrow gets done Tomorrow or I need to declare a backlog. I realize that I still have a ways to go before I can pat myself on the back. I still have not mastered the DIT discipline. But from the enormous benefits that I have gleaned thus far, I am utterly convinced that it will be worth the effort.
October 9, 2008 at 18:55 |
moises
moises
Okay, here is a situation that I have a lot. Let's say that I have 10 tasks on my will-do list for today. I get started in the morning and then I experience one of those days I described in my earlier post -- multiple interruptions and new tasks coming in that have to be done today. I practice good DIT methods so that all of the rest of the new incoming work goes on tomorrow's list. But, I was only able to get 5 out of the 10 tasks on my will-do list done today because of the interruptions and urgencies that developed. The remaining five tasks roll over to tomorrow's list. Combining this with the 10 new tasks that have already come in and I have a will-do list of 15 tasks tomorrow. I see on my schedule that I have four important meetings tomorrow and therefore have little time to work on my tasks. More tasks come in, and by the third day, I have maybe 25 tasks on the will-do list!!
I am thinking I should be able to look at my week and instead of only putting new work on just tomorrow that I could sprinkle tasks across several days so that the load is not so much on a day where I know I am not going to be able to get it all done.
Mark, what is your advice on how to approach this?
Thanks,
-David