Get Everything Done

I figure anyone looking at this forum will have tried a few time management systems: GTD, AF etc. Have you ever noticed that other people you work with don't talk much about how they manage their time. If you ask about systems they generally just look blank. I am interested because a good way to get better at something is to see what a person who does it well does. Unfortunately they often don't seem to know what they do.

So far I've worked out that most people have a series of habits they have built up. Broadly they turn to more formal lists when they are under pressure but don't seem to use lists normally.

What has everyone else noticed? Any habits from super efficient colleagues?

>> Have you ever noticed that other people you work with don't talk much about how they manage their time>>

I've mentioned this before on this forum. Amongst friends and family, I'm the only one who uses systems for motivation and structure.

In my experience, the world at work seems to divide into two distinct camps - thinkers and do-ers.

Asking thinkers to tackle a checklist of tasks is as much of a challenge as asking a do-er to say, write a presentation or solve a problem. My account handler (I work in advertising) is insanely efficient at getting things done, but ask her to write a creative brief and it will resemble something written by computer. We work well as a team but we'd be lost without each other.

At home I don't have the luxury of having a right hand man (the husband, as he tiresomely reminds me at every opportunity, is not my slave), so I have to be both thinker and do-er, and that's where it all falls apart.

I much liked PROCRASTINATION AND BLOCKING from Robert Boice. He looks how people split into procrastinators or efficient people in an academic environment . He documents good and bad practices over long periods of time; and is by this different to forum posts, where methods (tweaks) are mostly described at there creation stage. What I remember is that efficient people do things early, little and often; and by this work less; are more social; ... ... (...? time to reread the book).

Man of Kent

You say that "a good way to get better at something is to see what someone who does it well does. Unfortunately they often don't seem to know what they do."

I think the second sentence is very true. I think the reason is that they have developed "unconscious competence" - so they just get on with whatever it is without being aware of how they are doing it.

I also think you are right about the key being good habits. But the reason these are so difficult for the external observer to get a handle on is that the key habits are the mental ones that you employ before you ever start using external techniques such as AF.

I assume that key mental habits include giving yourself positive feedback; keeping a clear focus on what you are trying to achieve (and being clear about what is important); ensuring you focus on one task at a time rather than allowing yourself to be diverted from one to another mid-stream; pushing yourself to get things out of the way quickly; and not allowing yourself to lose track of time when engaged in a task. At least these are the things that I am coming to the conclusion I need to work on (and, despite many years of trying to improve, I see myself as less productive than many of the people I work with).

I have been trying to implement AF for some time now. Part of my problem initially was getting out from under the burden of the urgent to give the system a chance to work. But I now think my difficulties also stem from not having some of the above habits.

Sorry for not making myself clear Mark. When I say "tasks" I mean practical things that need to be done. Laundry, errands, set up for meetings, book holidays etc.

If you asked me to "think about new kitchen extension" I would have no problems doing that. If you asked me to "defrost freezer" it would have to go on my AF list (where it's been since February) and I'd ignore it at every pass until the freezer broke or my husband did it.

In my experience, the super efficient people at work are the ones who are clear and concise. They are clear on what they need to achieve and clear on what they need from other people.

There are quite a few people I deal with at work who will ramble on for 15 minutes to ask me to do something that could have been described in two sentences. These people include senior managers. I wonder how on earth they get anything done.

James T

"I see myself as less productive than many of the people I work with."

I've had that experience as well and indeed got the reputation for being less productive. Worse still as I've tried to get better other people find it funny that I try these methods. So I've sometimes ended up doing them secretly to avoid ridicule.

Caroline,

>>> In my experience, the super efficient people at work are the ones who are clear and concise. They are clear on what they need to achieve and clear on what they need from other people.

There are quite a few people I deal with at work who will ramble on for 15 minutes to ask me to do something that could have been described in two sentences. These people include senior managers. I wonder how on earth they get anything done. <<<

They don't. They direct others to do things and most often fail because they have no clue what they want done. They are mostly after "effects", so far as I have seen, and are rather vague about how to make them come about. This accounts for the rambling.

Man,

>>> "I see myself as less productive than many of the people I work with."

I've had that experience as well and indeed got the reputation for being less productive. Worse still as I've tried to get better other people find it funny that I try these methods. So I've sometimes ended up doing them secretly to avoid ridicule. <<<

Yeah, it is pretty much wise to keep changes to yourself. At best you get empty cheers for your success (which are pretty unbelievable and so leave you filled with doubt) and at worst, they try to explain why you are bound to fail (which leaves you filled with doubt). Don't explain ... do.

Caroline, About " In my experience, the super efficient people at work are the ones who are clear and concise. They are clear on what they need to achieve and clear on what they need from other people."

Totally agree in business the best i met are simple and direct. I met à new client he is 24 and has earned about a 100 M€ he did himself in just 5 years...

When i speak to him about twice a day i am always amazed by his concision and the precision of his thinking. He ask for advice, He lesson, decides, find a simple solution and simply say and apply it...

There is something wich astonish me he has about a 100 things in head how does he do... That make me thinking i have so many progress to do ;))

Anyway he is nothing but himself and just great.

So many people just play a rule !

I am not surprised the go directly on the wall one day...

Man of Kent,

I have always got a boost in motivation by proving someone wrong on something. So prove them wrong and have the last laugh. Many people don't really want you to succeed, it's just human nature.

James, I think the habits which you describe are key to becoming and being perceived as a very productive / effective / efficient worker. I don't know that it would be that difficult to adopt those habits either. Maybe that means starting off every day asking yourself those very questions. And keep on asking them throughout the day.

Years ago I worked at a company for a boss I didn't care for and was extremely unmotivated in my job, far from home and homesick, and everything in my life just wasn't working out very well. I got the one and only bad performance review I've ever had. I resolved to prove him wrong and set my mind to becoming the best worker he'd ever had. Three months later, he told me how amazed he was, took the credit for me being so great, gave me a raise and three months after that I quit and moved back home to a job I liked. So it is possible to turn things around. I just played the game, and focused only on the priorities that were important to him. And I learned to blow my own horn, which is hard to do if you're not a political animal.

I think one of the key things in work is to learn to be a self-starter (and finisher). Go to where there's problems and fix them. Bosses like people that will take a lot of initiative. I know that's what impressed me the most when I was a manager - people that I didn't have to manage. Someone that would come up to me and say 'give me something more to do' or 'let me take that project on'. Someone that would figure it out for themselves, that I wouldn't have to take the time to show them what to do. Someone who took it upon themselves to manage projects and other people in the group - who wasn't afraid to take ownership and responsibility for things and making sure they're done right. Those people are as rare as hen's teeth.

I find that there are many people who generate lots of activity yet can't grasp the big picture. At my office as far as time management everyone uses spiral notebooks and most people are productive with few things slipping through the cracks. others use word documents with simple project plans and some use Outlook Tasks function. No one has ever talked about time management.

I am actually working on a new hopefully simpler paper based method which I will publish in a week or so. I am not sure if it will be a free ebook or a nominal charge.

Gerry

Yes it's amazing how most people never talk about time management. it seems they just like doing things and not take a higher position to see if they can do better.
However i noticed that most productive peole i met were just using a simple spiral note book as i do too. But How ?

I think that as said MF the problem is (often) not about our time management but about the rules we accept to be productive.

Working little & often is a key,
Collect all info in a single system may be the secont,
Use good routines surely the third
Some others loke take altitude about the big picture,
Ask help to others ;) share and respect people,
Doing the right things and let down the others at the right time

After years ogf trying beeing organised i realised that in fact the best system is your system wich is stuck to your way of working

But How do we work ? And what do we want ?

In this forum what is very interesting is that people have all different problem. What is amazing is the way they try to solve them (as i do :)) )

Jacqueline

Thanks for your long reply to my post. Your advice is extremely sound. Being a self-starting problem-solver is clearly what one should aspire to. And if you aspire to something you will probably get there in the end.

However, you do have to be productive in the first place to have the spare time to take on initiatives.

As you say, what is key is what you tell yourself you are going to do each morning, together with a bit of evaluation at the end of the day of why things went right or wrong.

James, you're right about the 'spare time' part. I've made the unfortunate choice in some circumstances in the past of taking those projects / responsibilities on and working a lot of overtime to do it if necessary. I never did it to advance, but I did do it out of personal satisfaction.

The only way I know how to resolve that is to find a way to relieve yourself of the grunt work through automation, delegation etc. And if you can't do that, then pure speed and letting stuff go. Work can lead to so much unimportant trivia that can take up your whole day if you let it.

It would take someone better than I to figure out a way to be more productive using AF as a task management tool, which is why I don't use it at work. It requires you to use less conscious thought and planning rather than more.

Thanks for everyone's comment most interesting. I really agree with the clear and concise - really paring down your thoughts to the simple core.

Jacqueline - I can relate to the difficult boss. In my last job I had my first appraisal which started with the phrase, "You probably think this is going to go well". My boss went on to tell me that I only had one quality and that I wasn't arrogant. And as my friends told me I am! So I thought do I just leave or do I turn it around. I decided to turn it around. It half killed me but I did. After I handed in my notice (I was on six months notice) my boss didn't announce it and asked me for the next four months whether I thought I had made a mistake with my resignation and did I want to change my mind - nope. He eventually told me that I had improved a lot and that if I improved the same amount again I'd be quite good. High praise indeed. Makes me laugh now.

MOK
Dont be shocked about these kind of reflexion. There are 2 type of management
By fear or by agreement. I had may boss some were great some other were A...
A good boss is the one who knows his team and what are able to do of each of one.
It needs some quality such as confidence, encouragements, human talents.As for human there are no many of them. Just be yourself do things don't care about what they think or does and go on. It's your life not his.

Jacqueline - I am very interested in the fact that you do not use AF at work. What do you use instead, and why?

Jacqueline - I realise you have already answered my last question on another thread.

I am struck by your devotion to your work - 50-hour weeks PLUS spending part of Sunday morning thinking about your working methods. And I am worried that one of the mental habits you have developed to drive yourself forward - a sense of anxiety at the idea of backlogs - would, at least in me, raise my overall stress levels. I find it difficult enough to relax as it is!

"Jacqueline, I am struck by your devotion to your work - 50-hour weeks PLUS spending part of Sunday morning thinking about your working methods."

So do I. But one very friendly advice as an employee NEVER, NEVER, NEVER let you work take all your life. Take time to rest and most of all take 0half an hour each day thinking about you what you have already done, where you are and were you want to go.

A very good friend of mine who worked for a caracterial boss told me this story.
After office time his boss passes threw the office. If he saw someone working he told him "go back home, if you are still working it is because you dont work well (efficiently)"
More if he saw on a desk lot of stuff he threw all away on the floor. At noght all office desk has to be clean.

Think about this story as i did. I often work a lot but it is for myself it is my company. No one else. I indeed hope and swear i will never never never be back in the system.

All the best to you

James and Jupiter,

I never did that all the time. I worked in Corporate Reporting at the time - 3 times a year for two weeks at a very heavy pace, 11 monthends a year of a week at a fairly heavy pace and once a year for a month of those steady 60-70 hour weeks. By the time I left, we were down to 40-50 hour weeks with less staff - which is nothing in that world. My predecessor put in 90+ hour weeks, so I consider that relatively, I was a slacker. :-) My philosophy has always been "get in, get done, go home." The rest of the time was almost pure slack, where we left early to go for a beer, took long lunches, long weekends (we were the only team allowed to bank time) and prepped everything that we could. That's basically what I had to do - teach people how to work ahead. When you have to teach something is when you really learn how to do it. Lots of people don't like that environment because they never get the hang of working ahead or don't stay long enough to benefit from their prior experience, hence the high turnover before I became manager - and since I left - but I loved it. Jobs like that can create a very strong team environment where you become good friends because you're all pitching in together.

It is impossible to even create backlogs in that environment - things are either done or they aren't by a very hard deadline. You can't let anything drag out. And believe me, I am a super lazy person.

Now I work a regular 35 hour week plus have a good $$ consulting client where I put in about 15-20 hours a week. Those opportunities don't come around unless you've built up a reputation for delivering. But it doesn't bother me to work like this because (a) I can do the 35 hour/week job in 1/2 the time if I push myself and then do mindless stuff (like read/post on here). :-) There's a finite amount of work in that job, so I'm ok with that. I suppose I could work slower and drag the job out to fill the day, and my preference would be to finish at noon and go home, but they won't let me do that. :-( (b) That client is buying me a more enjoyable early retirement. And because the jobs are very different in nature, I'm not doing the same thing - sometimes a change is as good as a rest.

With respect to the idea of backlogs - I look at it as buying peace of mind. Put in the effort now to reap the benefit later (ie. be able to slack off later). If I was in a job where they just kept piling more on me because I happened to work efficiently and someone else didn't, I wouldn't stay long. :-)